Water/Methanol Or Propane Injection In Place Of Fuel Upgrades

[Codygroves95]

Hello everyone, I haven't made many upgrades to my truck yet but just trying to get ideas together for the future.

Here's my thinking: On my 2014 6.7, my hp goal will be somewhere around 700.

I want to go for twin turbos.

Of course, I'll have a bigger lift pump, but I'd like to keep that at the max of my fueling upgrades.

I've read that it can be done on stock fuel, but I wonder if a propane or meth injection system could help.

I do not want to sink money on injectors.

With the meth or propane injection, my thinking would help move more air and spool the turbos better, much like more fuel would.

Looking for any insight on this, if it would be worth it or actually help etc.

Thanks

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[Cam95]

Water meth will drop intake and egts.

I would look at doing nozzles if your injectors are good or going with a reman injector.

What twin set are you looking at that would give us all an idea on what to recommend.

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[Chrisn162001]

You definitely need injectors and a bigger CP3 for 700.

I wouldn’t even think about running meth on a newer truck unless you’ve exhausted all other ways of keeping egts down.

With twins on a 6.7 you really need better rods or a tune that that doesn’t ramp up torque in lower rpms, but then that defeats the purpose of twins.


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[TexNeck]

Air is the easy part. You can go with a single and still have it be streetable.

The s467 will get you to 700 which a lot of guys run.

Compounds is a better setup and if you have the budget for it and recommended for best street manners.

Rods aren’t a bad idea since the power curve is strong down low.

Head Studs would be needed as well (over 50 psi boost)

You will need more fuel than just a pump.

Pump is great - Fleece drop in or Fass unit are the way to go.

You will need a CP3 upgrade even if it’s a bag of parts.

Injectors will need to be upgraded as well.

Never get reman injectors with the ONLY exception being BBI brand.

Other than those buy new.

Remans are nothing but used bench tested cores.

Water meth seems to have lovers and haters.

I have been wanting a kit for my truck but haven’t pulled the trigger yet.

From my research when safely using meth (less than 50%) you can expect about a 10% bump in power (avg).

Everything you’ve mentioned is engine related.

What’s your transmission plan?

I'd be happy to work with you via email/PM on ideas and pricing.

FWIW you can build a 600hp truck (maybe 650) on stock fuel/meth.

Once you want more there is a significant jump in things that need attention.

Is this just a fun build, tow truck, or daily driver?

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[TexNeck]

You definitely need injectors and a bigger CP3 for 700.

I wouldn’t even think about running meth on a newer truck unless you’ve exhausted all other ways of keeping egts down.

With twins on a 6.7 you really need better rods or a tune that that doesn’t ramp up torque in lower rpms, but then that defeats the purpose of twins.


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Why the opposition to water meth on the newer trucks? (I’m not calling you out but curious why).

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[Chrisn162001]

Why the opposition to water meth on the newer trucks? (I’m not calling you out but curious why).

Meth is corrosive causes rust in the intake shelf.

Seems to get past the rings every truck I’ve seen running meth has grayish blow by from the crank case vent.

Controllers fail and cause issues.

Seen some ramp pressure to high, seen one stay stuck open and hydro lock engine.

If you are doing it for the power It’s easier to find an extra 50 hp and 100tq in the tune with common rail trucks.

In 12v’s I’d use it for egt control but that’s because you just dumped a bunch of fuel and tried to keep egts down.

You don’t really see many common rail trucks running water meth kits like you do with the older 12v trucks cause it’s not really needed for either power added or to control egts.

I don’t like consumable power adders in general due to long term cost.

Over life time you’ll spend more than the turbo or injector upgrade would have cost to begin with.

50/50 mix is 10-15 bucks a gallon plus shipping in most cases.

Yeah blue washer fluid is cheaper but it’s only around 30 percent meth and I’ve seen the detergents in it clog nozzles.

50/50 nets you about 40-50hp 70-80tq and 150-200 lower egts.

I feel for most people this is a “I’ll get this so I don’t have to get this” product.


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[Codygroves95]

Thanks for the info, this is just a very general plan for the next few years, mostly I was just curious, but I do use the truck for towing about a 15k trailer pretty regular but also do alot of daily driving so street manners are a must, hence the question about the twins, and I'd like to keep the factory exhaust brake if at all possible, I like the idea of VGT turbos, always have. As far as the transmission I know that will need to be upgraded, my plan at the moment is Allison swap when the funds present themselves. But 700 is really the max of my goal, I know these stock engines can't handle much more than that, 650 like you said would probly be a safer number, but I'd also like the possibility there to jump to higher horsepower pretty easy should I ever beef up the rods and pistons

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[Codygroves95]

Air is the easy part. You can go with a single and still have it be streetable.

The s467 will get you to 700 which a lot of guys run.

Compounds is a better setup and if you have the budget for it and recommended for best street manners.

Rods aren’t a bad idea since the power curve is strong down low.

Head Studs would be needed as well (over 50 psi boost)

You will need more fuel than just a pump.

Pump is great - Fleece drop in or Fass unit are the way to go.

You will need a CP3 upgrade even if it’s a bag of parts.

Injectors will need to be upgraded as well.

Never get reman injectors with the ONLY exception being BBI brand.

Other than those buy new.

Remans are nothing but used bench tested cores.

Water meth seems to have lovers and haters.

I have been wanting a kit for my truck but haven’t pulled the trigger yet.

From my research when safely using meth (less than 50%) you can expect about a 10% bump in power (avg).

Everything you’ve mentioned is engine related.

What’s your transmission plan?

I'd be happy to work with you via email/PM on ideas and pricing.

FWIW you can build a 600hp truck (maybe 650) on stock fuel/meth.

Once you want more there is a significant jump in things that need attention.

Is this just a fun build, tow truck, or daily driver?

Thanks for the info, this is just a very general plan for the next few years, mostly I was just curious, but I do use the truck for towing about a 15k trailer pretty regular but also do alot of daily driving so street manners are a must, hence the question about the twins, and I'd like to keep the factory exhaust brake if at all possible, I like the idea of VGT turbos, always have. As far as the transmission I know that will need to be upgraded, my plan at the moment is Allison swap when the funds present themselves. But 700 is really the max of my goal, I know these stock engines can't handle much more than that, 650 like you said would probly be a safer number, but I'd also like the possibility there to jump to higher horsepower pretty easy should I ever beef up the rods and pistons

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[TexNeck]

Thanks for the info, this is just a very general plan for the next few years, mostly I was just curious, but I do use the truck for towing about a 15k trailer pretty regular but also do alot of daily driving so street manners are a must, hence the question about the twins, and I'd like to keep the factory exhaust brake if at all possible, I like the idea of VGT turbos, always have. As far as the transmission I know that will need to be upgraded, my plan at the moment is Allison swap when the funds present themselves. But 700 is really the max of my goal, I know these stock engines can't handle much more than that, 650 like you said would probly be a safer number, but I'd also like the possibility there to jump to higher horsepower pretty easy should I ever beef up the rods and pistons

There are options for keeping VGT. Option 1 is keep factory turbo and do an add a turbo (s475+) which they have kits for. Option 2 replace factory VGT with Fleece Cheetah or similar which are rated for 700hp with the single. If you wanted more power after you could add a turbo on the Cheetah or the like.

If you want to do an Allison swap just to do it then that’s a cool route to go. Typically for under 850hp the RevMax units hold up very well so they would be worth looking into. If you are thinking there’s a shot over 850 then another route could be a billet 48re swap.

For fuel you could go dual pumps or 10mm stroker single. It’s debatable which is more reliable. Injectors you’d want at least 100% overs.

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[Chrisn162001]

Thanks for the info, this is just a very general plan for the next few years, mostly I was just curious, but I do use the truck for towing about a 15k trailer pretty regular but also do alot of daily driving so street manners are a must, hence the question about the twins, and I'd like to keep the factory exhaust brake if at all possible, I like the idea of VGT turbos, always have. As far as the transmission I know that will need to be upgraded, my plan at the moment is Allison swap when the funds present themselves. But 700 is really the max of my goal, I know these stock engines can't handle much more than that, 650 like you said would probly be a safer number, but I'd also like the possibility there to jump to higher horsepower pretty easy should I ever beef up the rods and pistons

My combo made 780hp on the dyno.

Has perfect street manners I pull 10-12k lbs of hay every other week.

I beat on it daily has been reliable for 30k miles now.

S467.7, 200% injectors, dual CP3s, push rods, springs and head studs, banks intercooler and intake horn.

Basically a Revmax 850 build with my own pump mods and a TCS billet input shaft retainer hub.

Revmax has made some significant developments in the 68RFE last year or so.

Their new 12XR setup is holding some serious power.

I have quite a few 800hp plus 68RFE's on the road a few are over 900hp.

A lot of bigger builders are having great success at 1000-1300 with the 68RFE.

Sub 1000hp I would stick with a 68RFE.


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